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He Knew He Was Right
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1st Q 2024 He Knew He Was Right - Anthony Trollope
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2. Analyze the theme of jealousy in "He Knew He Was Right." How is it depicted through various characters and situations?
3. Discuss the role of gender and societal expectations in the novel. How do these factors influence the characters' choices and relationships?
4. Examine the portrayal of marriage in the novel. What commentary does Anthony Trollope provide on the institution of marriage during the Victorian era?
5. Explore the character of Emily Trevelyan. How does she navigate the challenges presented by her marriage and societal expectations?
6. Investigate the subplot involving Colonel Osborne. How does this storyline contribute to the overall themes of the novel?
7. Analyze the impact of mental health and psychological struggles on the characters in the novel, particularly Louis Trevelyan. How does the society of the time respond to mental health challenges?
8. Discuss the portrayal of domestic life and family dynamics in "He Knew He Was Right." How do family relationships shape the characters' experiences and decisions?
9. Examine the role of social class in the novel. How does Trollope depict the interactions between characters from different social strata?
10. Explore the narrative structure of the novel. How does Trollope use multiple perspectives and subplots to weave a complex and nuanced story?
I am about 1/3rd of the way through the book and I will wait to address these questions as they seem to need further reading to fully answer. However, I have to say it was extremely difficult for me to appreciate the characters in the book, they all seem to be acting with exaggerated pride and misplaced convictions. Nora, Hugh and Dorothy were less extreme but Miss Stanbury, Emily, and of course Louis all made me want to scream. Priscilla, so far, seems sane. I suspect we will slowly get to the condemnation of Victorian societal values, particularly around gender roles, through these characters but I am not looking forward to the next third...
I'll be starting the audio book this week. I prefer listening to long books because I get less impatient with them, doing other things at the same time.
Finished the book last week, and finally getting a good enough hands day to respond now to the first quarter questions:1. The title really says it all: he’s stubborn, believes himself always correct and in better judgement than everyone else, even when there is evidence to the contrary. This fuels his jealousy, cruelty, and feuds with others. Apparently Trollope considers this book one of his worst because he made the protagonist “too unlikable”. Which I find funny because, while true, I think we’ve all met some Louis Trevelyans in our life.
2. I think I’ve said above how his personality adds to the jealous quality: it really comes out his feuds with his wife over seeing her friend Osborne which a…doesn’t make for a happy marriage for them or childhood for his son. You also see it when Nora starts getting attention. His jealousy is so fixed it escalates to delusion and then madness as the book goes on, won’t give exact details for those still reading.
3. I said “I think we’ve all met some Louis Trevelyans” above because he honestly does read like many modern ‘manosphere/redpill’ and emotional abusive men types. He encapsulates some of the worst traits of traditional manhood in ways that haven’t always changed enough over the ages (possessive, jealous, condescending, treating his female partner like property to some extent). Nora’s story is defined by marriage prospects, Aunt Stanbury’s independent wealth ultimately has male origins, which I’m glad we don’t always see as the case of women’s lives now. And while Emily defers to the social script in some ways, she is also at once an admiringly independent and strong spirited, and also an excessive stubborn person. I plays against gendered expectations of the time and I thought made her complex beyond just the “strong spirited/bull headed woman” conflicting tropes.
Mod
1. Explore the character of Louis Trevelyan. How does his personality and decisions contribute to the central conflicts in the novel?He's a stubborn man who becomes obsessed with the idea that his wife is allowing unacceptable familiarity from another man.
2. Analyze the theme of jealousy in "He Knew He Was Right." How is it depicted through various characters and situations?
Jealousy always seems to make the characters ridiculous. As well as Trevelyan, we have sibling rivalry between the French sisters who are competing with each other to "catch" an eligible clergyman.
3. Discuss the role of gender and societal expectations in the novel. How do these factors influence the characters' choices and relationships?
This book was written when married women in England had almost no power or independence, and everything they had belonged to their husband, just before the passing of the Married Women's Property Act. Emily Trevelyan would be penniless if her husband did not agree to continue to support her. Two of the strongest female characters in the novel have chosen to remain unmarried: Priscilla Stanbury and her aunt. Trollope describes both of them in a positive way with none of the "pitiful old maid" stigma that so often applies to unmarried women in novels, even today.
7. Analyze the impact of mental health and psychological struggles on the characters in the novel, particularly Louis Trevelyan. How does the society of the time respond to mental health challenges?
Louis does appear to suffer from some delusions. The attitude of most of the characters, including two doctors who are consulted, seems to be that people are either mad or sane, with no middle ground. Louis is afraid of being locked away, and although he seems a little paranoid, he's probably justified in fearing this because there was not much other treatment for "mad people".
I enjoyed this and gave it 4 stars. I was glad to be able to listen to it as an audiobook - I have more patience with long books in audio format. I didn't think it was Trollope's best book and I'm not surprised it was deleted from the list. I'm working my way through his Palliser series, and The Eustace Diamonds is my favourite so far.
I am 2/3rds of the way through and I am just now beginning to appreciate some of the secondary characters, plots and events. The core plot line regarding Emily and Louis is still causing me to put the book down quickly. I will persevere through March.
1. Explore the character of Louis Trevelyan. How does his personality and decisions contribute to the central conflicts in the novel? When he’s introduced, he sounds like a great guy – smart, well-liked, handsome. But, as Emily’s mother observes, he likes to have his own way. This trait gradually obliterates everything else. Eventually, he doesn’t even seem to care if his wife has been unfaithful. In ch. 79 he does not yield to Emily’s plea to reunite because if did, “…the world would say that in this contest between him and her he had been the sinning one, and she the one against whom the sin had been done. It was the chief object of his mind, the one thing for which he was eager that this should never come to pass. Let it once be conceded to him from all sides that he had been right, and then she might do with him almost as she willed.” This insane desire to be right no matter what the cost destroys his life.
2. Analyze the theme of jealousy in He Knew He Was Right. How is it depicted through various characters and situations?
Obviously it plays a huge role in the breakdown of the Trevelyan marriage (see above). It is also evident in the French sisters’ rivalry for the hand of Mr. Gibson.
3. Discuss the role of gender and societal expectations in the novel. How do these factors influence the characters' choices and relationships?
Men need to earn a living and women need to get married, ideally to a man who earns a good living. And even more ideally to a man with a good living and a peerage. As Trollope says in ch. 39: “Assured morality in a husband is a great thing. Assured good temper is very excellent. Assured talent, religion, amiability, truth, honesty, are all desirable. But an assured income is indispensable.” And a woman who is married is automatically superior to an unmarried woman. In ch. 72, he tells the story of three old maids. The youngest gets the privilege of entering and leaving a room first because she once had an offer of marriage. Just being proposed to bestows rank and privilege above other “spinsters.”
4. Examine the portrayal of marriage in the novel. What commentary does Anthony Trollope provide on the institution of marriage during the Victorian era?
Duty comes up a lot – e.g. it is Emily’s duty to obey her husband. Trollope doesn’t actually endorse this view, however, and Nora and Hugh’s relationship suggests that this idea of marriage is changing. For example, in ch. 95 Nora asserts that she is marrying for “liberty,” and doesn’t believe that young men marry to “get a slave.” And in the final chapter he writes that Emily might have been able to avoid trouble in her married life by keeping “her neck in the dust under [her husband’s] foot.” This seems to be his attitude toward Victorian-era marriage. Then again, his mocking depiction of the feminist poet Wallachia Petrie shows that female independence should only go so far.
5. Explore the character of Emily Trevelyan. How does she navigate the challenges presented by her marriage and societal expectations?
At first, she seems like kind of a brat, honestly. After Louis kidnaps her son, she became more sympathetic to me. And she shows real backbone when she decides to stay in Italy and look after him, even after her son is returned.
6. Investigate the subplot involving Colonel Osborne. How does this storyline contribute to the overall themes of the novel?
I wouldn’t call this a subplot; Colonel Osborne is the reason for the Trevelyan separation – he knows better, but he cannot resist visiting Emily at the Clock House because of his ego.
7. Analyze the impact of mental health and psychological struggles on the characters in the novel, particularly Louis Trevelyan. How does the society of the time respond to mental health challenges?
In ch. 38 (“Verdict of the Jury – ‘Mad, my Lord’”), Louis obsesses about Emily and Col Osborne almost to the point where he hopes it is true because that would cause more pain. As crazy as he behaves with regard to his wife and child, the powers that be seem to think that as long as he is not in danger of hurting himself or others, he’s free to do as he likes. Everyone that the family consults suggests that it would be difficult to have him declared insane, and that if he would be committed, it would be difficult to every “undo” the label (i.e. to ever have him declared competent).
8. Discuss the portrayal of domestic life and family dynamics in "He Knew He Was Right." How do family relationships shape the characters' experiences and decisions?
See question #4 above.
9. Examine the role of social class in the novel. How does Trollope depict the interactions between characters from different social strata?
In ch. 71 Sir Marmaduke finds out that Hugh has a monthly salary, which believes is barely better than weekly wages. It doesn’t matter what he is paid but how, it seems. But then again, Sir Marmaduke doesn’t really believe a gentleman should have to “work.” Ch. 62 has a long description of committee testimony, which may seem to be a digression, but it actually has a lot to do with this theme. Sir Mandrake is the governor of a colony and barely knows how its government functions: “A man may govern the Mandarins and yet live in comparative idleness. To do such governing work well a man should have a good presence, a flow of words which should mean nothing, an excellent temper, and a love of hospitality.”
10. Explore the narrative structure of the novel. How does Trollope use multiple perspectives and subplots to weave a complex and nuanced story?
We get almost omniscient narration, always knowing what every character is doing and thinking. If we are completely omniscient, we know more than any single character. This can create suspense – i.e., we know that Trevelyan has hired Bozzle and we wait to see what affect that will have on Emily when she finds out.
Mod
2. Analyze the theme of jealousy in "He Knew He Was Right." How is it depicted through various characters and situations?
Trevalyn accuses his wife of infidelity with an "older male friend of her parents".
Jealousy of the two sisters Camilla and Belle.
Even the jealousy of giving up the running of one's home (minor).
3. Discuss the role of gender and societal expectations in the novel. How do these factors influence the characters' choices and relationships?
I found it most annoying that never once was the harm being done to the child by this unreasonable man ever mentioned. It was as if the child only existed in order to show the gender and societal expections of the husband's rights.
4. Examine the portrayal of marriage in the novel. What commentary does Anthony Trollope provide on the institution of marriage during the Victorian era? marriage is portrayed as romantic, but also as a way of maintaining social standing. Marriage was something that Emily maybe rushed into because they were in love. Belle on the other hand felt free to be engaged for an extended period and Nora was willing to wait for parent's blessings, sister's misery to come to an end.
5. Explore the character of Emily Trevelyan. How does she navigate the challenges presented by her marriage and societal expectations? Emily would be the picture of the perfect Christian wife to stay with her husband, to love him in sickness and in health, and to love her child. She also was an example of stubbornness. But I have a hard time to see that she had much choice except initially she could have told the family friend to stay away. But would that have really solved the problem of her husband's jealousy.
6. Investigate the subplot involving Colonel Osborne. How does this storyline contribute to the overall themes of the novel? I think it was summed up well by the old lady when she said that Osborne chose to create a problem when he knew he was doing so.
7. Analyze the impact of mental health and psychological struggles on the characters in the novel, particularly Louis Trevelyan. How does the society of the time respond to mental health challenges? This unreasonable man and his unwillingness to change results in loss of friends and family. He was not considered mad enough to be locked up but if he was a woman, he would have been locked up.
8. Discuss the portrayal of domestic life and family dynamics in "He Knew He Was Right." How do family relationships shape the characters' experiences and decisions? I liked how Trollope showed the differences in these "courting relationships" and Nora was certainly a very impressive woman. The Marmaduke's raised some pretty good daughters.
9. Examine the role of social class in the novel. How does Trollope depict the interactions between characters from different social strata? I am not going to go into detail here but I did think it interesting that after Nora and Hugh marry, society accepted it as demonstration that one could rise in society by marriage.
10. Explore the narrative structure of the novel. How does Trollope use multiple perspectives and subplots to weave a complex and nuanced story? not going to go into detail here but will say that I think the subplots were more interesting than the main story and that without them, this story would have been a painful read.
Okay I guess I better boogie on part 2 and 3 of these questions:4. I like Kristel's answer here about how different main characters in this novel have different motivations to marry, which is a great reflection of the period as it is set in kind of a social transition point. It is after the romanticist idea of love marriage becomes more popularized, but still in the sphere of when social/economic match marriages were still extremely common as well.
5. I like that the previous comments for this one are "she's a brat" vs "she's stubborn but really didn't have much real choice/autonomy regardless". I can get both perspectives here as it does read on the surface that she's incapable of picking her battles and could make not seeing her friend again as an easy compromise....and yet Louis is also an extremely unreasonable person (I would argue to a much higher degree) and there really is no socially acceptable Victorian way in which she can respond to his jealousy in a way that isn't fully submitting to him. And yeah...Louis is so paranoid and full of jealousy that if it wasn't Colonel Osborne, it likely would have been something else.
6. Agree that he is essential to the main plot. Louis' excessive response to him is not his fault, but he really could have just backed off from this family if he was a more decent person as well, considering his friendship with Emily is (likely?) just that. What he is fulfilling is something relatively minor to him at the massive cost to Emily (and he knows this). This book really does narratively function on the basis that there is something a bit rebellious and selfish at the core of everyone involved (still very true to real life people).
Pt 3 Qs:7. As a reflection of the times, not well as he alienates everyone around him without there being any positive resources for helping him and not only seeing his breakdown as a character flaw. Also, (like how Kirstel says he would have been locked up as a woman), I genuinely think the male entitlement he is socialized into helps convince him that his demands and jealousy, and possessiveness are rational and reflect things owed to him, which makes it harder to sort out the pathology aspect and receive real help either.
8. Yeah there are some interesting and varied dynamics of this one- from the relative sense of autonomy and independence in the Marmaduke girls, that reflects a openness to allowing your family to grow as people, which is then contrasted with the oppressive atmosphere of Louis' home. It then kind of gives this picture of well, of course Emily responded the way she did across the novel.
9. Agree with the previous answers here.
10. I feel like this question kind of answers itself: with multiple perspectives we get a sense of subjectivity inserted in some of the events and characterizations, this is itself what adds nuance and complexity to the understanding of this story.
overall, I found the themes of following and disobeying the social script based on class and gender to be interesting but I wasn't over the moon into it and gave it 3 stars.
1) Louis Trevelyan has an expectation that his wife should instinctively know exactly how to behave to make him, the husband, feel validated as a husband and a man. When she does not behave in that expected way, he can not allow himself to question the roles and the societal rules, rather he sees himself as persecuted and horribly wronged. Further, as his friends do not see things the same way, he turns against them with a great deal of paranoia involved. 2) Largely the theme is played out through Louis and his wife Emily but it is more interesting in Nora's mother being jealous of the Spalding girl marrying Lord Peterborough rather than her daughter and how Nora comes to view the Lord's estate. Also the jealousy between Camilla and Arabella in regards to both Dorothy and Mr. Gibson and then towards each other.
3. As others have mentioned, the women in this novel had very prescribed choices. They were expected to marry and to do so in such a way to bring money and stability into the family. At the very least they were expected to think about "bread and cheese". However, once married, or once it was decided that one would not marry, the women had a bit more of a range of behaviors. Miss Stanbury, and Lady Milborough lead their own life and lived well. Priscilla lead her own life and lived less well but she clearly felt that was "right". The men were expected to keep up appearances, earn money, and do great deeds.
4. Trolloppe viewed marriage with wit and sarcasm in this novel but also ultimately gave some of his characters a real chance to find "love" as opposed to "marriage". Marriage was simply a contract and didn't have much to do with sentimental emotions, although it did have much to do with "honor and obey".
5. In fact, having been brought up in the Mandarins, Emily doesn't grasp how she is breaking the English rules and exactly how she is breaking the rules. She does not navigate very well in that it is not what she did or did not do but rather what she has let other people believe, what she has allowed others people to gossip about and all of that reflected poorly on Louis who thought that Emily was being wayward and stubborn about it. How any women could navigated well during that time is amazing to me.
6. Colonel Osborne is a bit of a villain in this book although all he really does is to tempt Emily across a very very fine line. Emily does nothing wrong, but Colonel Osborne is allowed to be seen as having done something wrong which is to his credit in the male world and to his detriment in the female world.
7. When Louis starts acting out of the character of a gentlemen, i.e. above the fray, outwardly gracious while being unbendingly civil, people begin to use the word "mad". He is a bit obsessed at this point and he is very unclear about his own role although overly clear about his wife's role However, no modern person would use the term "mad" at this juncture. However, as he truly begins to fall apart, body and soul, he does begin to exhibit extreme tendencies, particularly paranoia. Although doctor's treated his affliction with some care, there was little that they could do. And as mentioned above, a women exhibiting these behaviors would probably have been locked away at the time.
9. Largely the characters in the novel are all from a upper class social strata. Martha is certainly more than a servant although she is working class. Even the bankers, writers, lawyers, professional people are expected to adhere to the upper class values to the extent that they can within their income. Sir Marmaduke, as part of the foreign service, has a great deal of honor and very little money.
10. The four main subplots below that of Louis and Emily: Mr. Gibson and his problems with love, Hugh Stanbury and Nora, Mr. Glascock and Nora and then Caroline Spalding, and Dorothy and Brooke were all nicely augmented by the additional characters of Miss Stanbury, Lady Milborough, Emily's parents etc. It made for a rich world to treat the themes of a woman's role, the expectations placed on both genders from society, the ability of one gender to bend the rules while the other gender found the rules rather unbendable. In reading all these subplots we are given different perspectives of the same story which allowed for the nuance.
1. I began by thinking that Louis Trevalyan was a pompous and rigid misogynist, who deserves his wife’s scorn. But as he spiralled into depression I suspected that he had always had been of uncertain mental health. Emily was equally rigid in refuting his concerns. They were spectacular in their miscommunication with each other. The inequality of gender roles was Trollope’s theme.2. Like Othello, Trevalyn refuses to listen to his wife’s denials. The sparring between the French sisters is more for comic effect. Both are examples of jealousy.
3. The obsession with making good matches was topical at the time Trollope write his novel. He examines female dilemma at great length!
4. Marriage was a transaction. No one mentioned sexual attraction. It seems comical now that someone with whom one has had a few brief conversations, always in the presence of others, could be labelled a lover!
5. Emily refused to be cowered by a bullying husband. He demanded that she admitted adulterous behaviour when there was none, she adamantly refused. She realised the consequences of their standoff too late to restore his health.6. Colonel Osborne revelled in his attractiveness to females and he could not care less about the havoc he wrought in pursuing his egoistical games. He thrilled that Trevalyn responded so violently to his behaviour.
7. Mental illness was treated ineffectually by general practitioners. Incarceration or ignoring the problem seemed to be the only alternatives.
8.Social interactions were heavily proscribed. There were days when one could visit friends for tea, provided, of course by servants. Everyone was hyper vigilant to what others might judge.
9. Lashings of snobbery, for example, the general attitude to Hugh writing for the gutter press, despite being a qualified barrister. It was highly desirable to live on unearned income. People like Sir Marmaduke, in an elevated role, could be absolutely incompetent without losing his position.
10. Some of the most delicious satire was in the subplots, particularly Mrs Gibson and his troubles with the French sisters, Mrs Trevalyn’s despair at Nora refusing Mr Gascott and Aunt Trevalyn’s absolute resolutions, which turned out to be changeable after all.
Link to ebook: https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/5140