The Sword and Laser discussion

I finished the book yesterday, and felt like bringing this up, especially given Beukes's acknowledgements at the end.

Beukes mentions all the people who helped her in doing research for this book, and that really impressed me. It's honestly really neat to know that so much of this book is based on actual, real history, not something the author made up for the purposes of telling a story.

Which is why all these little instances of research failure stand out so much, at least to my American ears in the audio book.

And it really is a lot of very little things. Things like, "what do cross-walk signs look like in the US?" and "what do you call the part of the car that covers the engine in the US?" and "what's the name of that famous murder mystery board game in the US?"

I get why this stuff might not occur to Beukes, and given that she's from South Africa, I can see why she made those slip-ups, but it just feels awkward, given how the story focuses on the Very American city of Chicago, and the amount of research into some pretty obscure topics that went into this, only to then skip over these really common, almost obvious things.

I guess the real lesson here is, "if you're writing a book set in a country you don't live in, get a local to read through it before publication."

^ Okay, I have to say I'm really impressed at how closely you read the book. First off, I didn't notice any of those. Second, regarding the first occupant of the house using it for gambling, I didn't get that at all. Clearly I missed some stuff while reading.

Well, I did do the audiobook, so that might be part of it. And this isn't the first time I've come across examples of "author from UK/Commonwealth country gets details about life in the US wrong."

And after the first one (where Harper's POV notes the crosswalk signs as having "green men"), I was ready to come across more.

As to the money thing, yeah, that's where all Harper's money comes from, and why it comes in different designs.

It's only fair. When setting a book overseas it is quite common for the author to get these details wrong. Noth American authors do it all the time.

She did get the feel of Chicago right (amazing and a shit hole at the same time) and she has lived there. These details are hard and using the right words for them even harder. An example, I still refer to footpaths as sidewalks. I only spent 6 years in the US and the rest of my life in Australia and the UK. Even so that Americanism has infected my brain completely and it would take a significant effort to get it right.

I agree that oversights like this can throw you out of a narrative. I think I'm inclined to wonder if this isn't something an editor should have caught, instead of blaming the author.

Iain wrote: "It's only fair. When setting a book overseas it is quite common for the author to get these details wrong. Noth American authors do it all the time.

She did get the feel of Chicago right (amazing..."

Your brain has been so badly infected you’ve forgotten the word “pavement”!

Seth wrote: "I agree that oversights like this can throw you out of a narrative. I think I'm inclined to wonder if this isn't something an editor should have caught, instead of blaming the author."

OP is blaming the beta readers. Best bet would be to have a beta reader or two from Chicago.

I personally love the show Frasier, but I always get a chuckle when they get something very wrong about Seattle.

I'm not even necessarily blaming beta readers.

I just think that somewhere in this process, someone maybe should have noticed these things.

I recently read a five-book series by a hybrid author (some tradpub, some indie.) The series had been published traditionally before rights reverted and gone through another edit. I still noticed about a dozen errors per book. Didn't affect my enjoyment of the books but I did notice them.

Another sitch...an anthology I was in, we got everyone else's stories before publication. I went through and casually noted obvious errors and sent a list to the editor, to diplomatically send back to the writers as he saw fit. All of the authors made the changes...except one, who was known for typos and whose count was equal to all of the other typos for all authors in the rest of the antho. He fixed maybe half. And his story was still the best in the antho by far.

Seth wrote: "I agree that oversights like this can throw you out of a narrative. I think I'm inclined to wonder if this isn't something an editor should have caught, instead of blaming the author."

There is always enough blame to spread like peanut butter.

Failure is an orphan, success has a thousand fathers.

John (Taloni) wrote: "I recently read a five-book series by a hybrid author (some tradpub, some indie.) The series had been published traditionally before rights reverted and gone through another edit. I still noticed a..."

Thats actually far more frustrating. Errors happen, and are hopefully spotted and corrected. But the ones that still happen despite being spotted are infuriating.

Ruth wrote: "Iain wrote: "It's only fair. When setting a book overseas it is quite common for the author to get these details wrong. Noth American authors do it all the time.

She did get the feel of Chicago r..."

Not in Australia. But you are right. I can’t even remember the term pavement being used and that’s after 21 years living in England. Sigh

J wrote: "John (Taloni) wrote: "I recently read a five-book series by a hybrid author (some tradpub, some indie.) The series had been published traditionally before rights reverted and gone through another e..."

I remind myself that perfect is the enemy of the good. Maybe if some authors accepted good enough we would actually some finished series.

Perfecting one short story may cost the author too much to be worthwhile. This cost can come in many forms and it is up to the author to set that line.

Isn't there a lot of feedback that Book 2 of the Kingkiller Chronicles was not as good as Book 1? I'd think with that reaction if I was Patrick Rothfuss I'd be leery of "good enough" for the next book. Would hate to follow up "that brilliant Name of the Wind" with "boy did he end that series with a whimper."

I missed the perfect opportunity at the start of this thread to mention that I bought my wife new abacus beads for Christmas.

It's the little things that count.

Oaken wrote: "I missed the perfect opportunity at the start of this thread to mention that I bought my wife new abacus beads for Christmas.

It's the little things that count."

Groooaaannn

I found a different 'minor' error. It's key to the plot that Kirby has a My Little Pony in 1976 when she was 9 (anachronistic) but when she was going through her toy box there were other toys that were anachronistic as well.

A princess Leia toy makes sense for a kid of the 70s, but she states that the outfit is from Empire. Okay, maybe she got it when she was 13.

But she also states that there is an Evil-Lyn. That's from 1983.

J wrote: "I found a different 'minor' error. It's key to the plot that Kirby has a My Little Pony in 1976 when she was 9 (anachronistic) but when she was going through her toy box there were other toys that ..."

That’s just weird. Almost like it was deliberate, or simply really lazy.