The Sword and Laser discussion

So, with Dungeon Crawler Carl, if the topic of the "Isekai" sub-genre doesn't come up in the Book Briefing, it might come up on the podcast, so I have a few quick notes on the sub-genre and the ways Dungeon Crawler Carl falls into it. (I'm not calling it DCC, because that's way too close to a tabletop RPG I play and I want to avoid confusion). I bring this up not to use genre as a straightjacket, but more so, for those who finish the book who want something else (that isn't Dungeon Crawler Carl), I have some examples and guidelines to look for.

Isekai is generally used to describe works of portal fantasy where the protagonist, or the protagonist along with a group of supporting characters end up transported or reincarnated to another world. Sometimes it's following death by automotive or other vehicle mishap. Sometimes it's by actively being summoned to that world - where they are granted magical powers and tasked with fighting some form of dark lord. Sometimes they're trapped in the world of a full-dive MMORPG due to deliberate action by the designer or from some other, unexplained outside force.

Often the character will retain full knowledge of their previous life in our world - and often (but not always) they will find their life in this new world more rewarding and not necessarily want to return (though in the case of Isekai from Asian countries - because there's spill-over to China and Korea - there's at least a little degree of culinary homesickness, which will lead to the character "inventing" some culinary staple from back home which revolutionizes local cusine, like Soy Sauce). What differentiates Isekai and LitRPG from other examples of portal fantasy, like Narnia or John Carter of Mars, is that the world incorporates the language of games. However, the games which are having their structural language invoked (so to speak) aren't necessarily RPGs (as with Dungeon Crawler Carl). There are a lot of Isekai works that have come out recently that instead draw heavy inspiration from dating sims and visual novels (such as My Next Life as a Villainess, All Routes Lead To Doom!).

Another thing that makes Isekai different to (for example) Dungeon Crawler Carl is in Isekai, the protagonist has moved into a world that is different from their home world, whereas in Dungeon Crawler Carl, the main characters home world itself has changed. An example of another, similarly popular work that fits this example is the Korean series 나 혼자만 레벨업/Na Honjaman Rebereop, which was also localized in English with the title of Solo Leveling (the literal translation of the title is closer to "Only I Level Up", which is probably a better description of the premise). It's also game based fantasy, but it's one where magical portals have opened into our world, and those who go inside can basically delve into dungeons to get magical items and other treasure, but if no one goes in, the portals will disgorge monsters into the world. Another is Gate, which mashes up this sub-genre with the techno-thriller, with the premise being around a portal to a fantasy realm opening in Tokyo, and the JSDF getting on top of that and setting up a Forward Operating Base on the other side of the portal, along with how this impacts geopolitics.

Probably the best umbrella term to use for this I've seen used for (flails arms frantically) all of this, Isekai included, is GameLit - but nobody's actually come up with a good term for works where the portal fantasy ends up transforming and changing "our" world (like with Solo Leveling and Dungeon Crawler Carl). Y'all got any ideas?

And, as a quick follow-up note, if you're going "But aren't those manga?" - the manga are adaptations of the original novels. The comparison I'd make would be if Fourth Wing or Sarah J. Maas' Court of Thorns and Roses series received adaptations to comics and animation. And if you're wondering how those would be toned down from something R or NC-17 rated, when that comes up in with the adaptations of Light Novels, they often don't tone those parts down. Not the violence, and if there are spicy bits, then it's usually run in a manga magazine that allows that in some form or another.

I don’t see Dungeon Crawler Carl as belonging in any version of Portal Fantasy or Isekai because he doesn’t go anywhere. It’s still Earth, it’s just been transformed. I don’t think there’s a name for such a genre even though these stories abound and, indeed, some of the most famous stories are these World Transformation stories, many of them time travel or invasion tales.

Transformation stories typically involve a character or group of characters changing from one form to another. Jack L. Chalker specialized in these sorts of stories. Go to the Well World and become a centaur or lizard person or talking plant. Cross the River of Dancing Gods and change into a barbarian or fairy or ogre. Vampire, zombie and werewolf stories are frequently Transformation stories. I think the protomolecule aspect of The Expanse is an example of both types of Transformation stories.

Examples of World Transformation include Back to the Future, which is fairly limited and localized (BttF 2 is larger), Darwinia where an entire continent is changed, the TV series Primeval where the entire planet is changed by time travel, the Southern Reach series by Jeff VanderMeer (Annihilation) where the change is localized but spreading, Jumanji* changes the town, and so on.

Dungeon Crawler Carl is another example and I agree with you that it is clearly in the LitRPG (aka GameLit) genre because the aliens have gamified the world and the overarching story follows the conventions of RPGs: following specific rules, beating bosses, leveling up, etc.

LitRPG is more of a style than a genre as we typically use the term, being more akin to comedy or drama. LitRPG stories are almost always Fantasy or Science Fiction, but they don’t have to be. Squid Game is the most famous example. One could argue that the Saw movies and similar stories are GameLit.



* Interestingly, the Jumani sequels Jumanji: Welcome to the Jungle and Jumanji: The Next Level are LitRPG Portal Fantasy Transformation stories in that the characters are sucked into the game and they are changed into game characters.

CountZeroOr wrote: "And, as a quick follow-up note, if you're going "But aren't those manga?" - the manga are adaptations of the original novels. The comparison I'd make would be if Fourth Wing or Sarah J. Maas' Court..."

I’m sensing a bit of defensiveness about both genre and manga. Don’t be ashamed that you read SFF or what form your stories take. You don’t need to apologize for it.

Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie was on Late Night with Seth Meyers recently and she was utterly dismissive of graphic novels, regarding them with the same disdain literature professors often have for The Lord of the Rings, guaranteeing that I’m not going to read her books. That kind of gatekeeping is stupid and counterproductive.

The defensiveness is more in response to the whole "We generally don't talk about sequential art (e.g. comics, manga) on Sword & Laser" thing, as for why we might not talk about this topic.

CountZeroOr wrote: "Y'all got any ideas?"

World merge?
And beneath that depending on the effect of the portal / merge sub-sub-genres of portal apocalypse, portal dying earth, portal post-apocalypse, portal utopia, portal dystopia, portal grimdark and so on.

You could probably bolt on other descriptors depending on how niche you wanted to go: Cosy LitRPG Lovecraftian Portal Post-apocalyptic Detective fantasy Romantasy.