On Tyrants & Tributes : Real World Lessons From The Hunger Games discussion

Learn Liberty Academy is curious...How far would the powers-that-be have to go before you set your sights on revolution?

As disgusted and dissatisfied I am with the current state of government, I don't think I can 100% stand behind a revolution until I am personally affected by injustice (which I'm sure I'll happen soon - the police in my town and I do not get along lol). Although the minute I hear a story about any child or innocent person become disenfranchised due to our system, I want to revolt, but it quickly subsides :(

Everyday I hear of all the bad news of how people are suffering because of our system and I just want to start a revolutionary war, I hate that America has changed so much.

The government now days is very corrupt since Obama has denounced our constitution i believe the president should be impeached. he might even take away our civil rights and this is a part of our liberty which includes; freedom of the press, freedom of religion, right to bear arms, and the right for a fast speedy trial.

To shed blood would take quite a bit. I believe it was Jefferson who said that we need a revolution every generation to keep us on track; I believe the Framers of our Constitution attempted to set up a governmental structure that would allow for peaceful revolutions. On another note, the revolution will not work if we do not make clear what it is that we are attempting to change. At this point, the clarity is not there. Perhaps that is the point of this question? Somehow we need to try to work our way back to the Constitution of 1789. Unless we attempt to do this within our current system first, I fear we would meet with an even worse situation...meet District 13.

every time I hear this question It just makes me think of how life was back then they loved there presidents and the presidents did a lot for us as people they gave us liberty and the right to have our own religion. the only thing that I would fight for liberty is if I couldn't learn more about my religion
I think America needs God back in there lives how it used to be.

I fight everyday. By simply speaking out against government I believe a peaceful revolution is necessary. I do not want any blood shed but we do need a revolution. I speak to people within my city mainly my college, like and share photos on Facebook, make Facebook status talking about the problems, sign petitions, and voice myself on youtube. I have slowly helped some people become aware of what the government is doing. But it's not an easy task and I am usually ignored.

a way for a peaceful revolution would be to petition for the impeachment of presidents that disgrace the constitution of our fathers. just imagine a country where you are put on a routine you must follow by governmental force and you lose your liberty for this broken corrupt government. this destroys are bill of rights and every thing we patriots fought for.

Maybe my sights are already set on it...

Uhm. I think that I'd be willing to oppose the Government when they do anything at all I disapprove of. As in, I'd speak out about this, sign petitions etc. If I felt particularly passionately about an issue, I'd engage in peaceful protest. However, there's a difference between willingness to oppose the Government on particular issues and seeing the entire system as inherently flawed. I don't think the democratic system in my country (The UK) is systemically flawed. The way to improve a democracy is, in my opinion, is through engaging with politics. Voting, running for office, peaceably protesting, journalism etc.
I wouldn't want to be part of a revolution unless the government was undemocratic. Even then, I wouldn't necessarily, unless there were systemic human rights abuses (the amount of these there would have to be is really rather hard to put a figure on).
A lot less would mean I'd up and move to another country, however.

I think the people should always engage in a peaceful revolution when the government is overstepping its boundaries - you could argue that's what libertarians are doing now on the internet with the Information Age. I do not think we are even near the point yet of having to engage in violence, something I want to avoid. However, I think our real enemy right now is propaganda, misleading rhetoric, and misinformation.

I was born a rebel. Yes that is a cliche but I grew up challenging and fighting my parents, teachers, and other authority figures who I disagreed with. I had ADHD in a pre-ADHD world so when it came to being told to wait or sit still I started looking for a way to break out.
Objecting to a government which trys to regulate every aspect of your life was just the next step.
Going to city council meetings, TEA party rallies, ranting online, and supporting outsider candidates is where I put my energy.
Peacefully objection to unjust policies is as far go right now. I would not see myself supporting a full revolution unless the current government was beyond hope and the forces looking to take over would be better.

I've always done things my own way, always proved I could do something after I was told I couldn't. Maybe it's the competitive (aka defiant) side of me. I speak out against perceived injustice pretty quickly. I've advocated for the rights of children in foster care, for example, by writing to legislative leaders; however, I'm not sure that I would go beyond peaceful protests and I do bow down to authority when it appears I will not get my way. If I see injustice and if freedom is stripped from the people to the point where people are no longer comfortable, I think I'd be on the bandwagon of revolt.

I feel like I probably wouldn't take a substantial action unless I was facing a directly noticeable personal loss. Something in the form of threat of physical harm to myself or a family member would likely draw a response. However we are losing smaller liberties everyday, and I am guilty of letting those go for the sake of convenience. It's far easier to just agree to some slight inconvenience than make a bigger scene than is already occurring.

To me there is already so many reasons to stand up for liberty as with the NSA and government powers impending on privacy and the militarization of police. But when they come knocking on the door and start to enforce something on you is when I would really start to.

Will wrote: "I feel like I probably wouldn't take a substantial action unless I was facing a directly noticeable personal loss. Something in the form of threat of physical harm to myself or a family member would likely draw a response..."

I agree with that, I think that was spot on. But I'm not alright with letting the loss of smaller liberties go for the sake of convenience or not making a scene. I say that because in my opinion, that's what's going to start the loss of bigger liberties. When people start to ignore the loss of smaller liberties they may not notice when bigger liberties are taken away too. So I'd most probably peacefully protest when I notice the loss of liberty, and I'd probably join a revolution group, or something along those lines, if something were to happen to my family.

There is so much to personally lose when standing up to the state that it is easier to stand down. I see people standing up and I think about how brave they are, but I just don't know what I would do. The state has too much power to ruin my personal well-being that I can't imagine confronting it. I think this is why Katniss is so appealing to us. She does stand up, albeit unwillingly and often unwittingly.

I would try to expatriate before taking up arms against tyranny (unless faced with immediate danger of bodily injury). It is only when this option is taken away from me that I would engage in violent revolution.

All it would take for me to be involved on the resistance against the state would be a leader.

Although, here in Australia it's probably even more dangerous to refuse government demands than in America. We have been disarmed to the point of no return. We'd essentially be defending ourselves with kitchen knives or bolt action hunting rifles (With a magazine capacity of less than 6 rounds, and only one magazine allowed) per 10,000 people or so.

Matty wrote: "All it would take for me to be involved on the resistance against the state would be a leader.

Although, here in Australia it's probably even more dangerous to refuse government demands than in Am..."

Your statement about disarming is perhaps the most worrisome. I don't know anything about Australian politics. Do you see increasing levels of state encroachment and tyranny there?

Valerie wrote: "Matty wrote: "All it would take for me to be involved on the resistance against the state would be a leader.

Although, here in Australia it's probably even more dangerous to refuse government dema..."

They take away as much of our freedom as is happening in America every year except we don't have a constitution to fall back on or good people like Ron Paul, Ben Swann, John Stossel helping us defend it. And we have a lot more 'nanny state' rules and people supporting the government 'protecting' people from themselves.

A small difference I've noticed between Australia and America is that our defence force budget is significantly less than in America, but half of our federal budget is spent on welfare. Even people that don't need financial help get it, and a lot of people think it's a good deal, to pay taxes and get some back, less government employee costs, general costs, inefficiency costs and etc. It's a crazy idea.

I am already fighting for liberty peacefully as I can through promoting the truth of wars, educating people through the non aggression principle, and signing petitions to act on my part. In terms of a violent revolution, the state would have to show their presence of force for me to civilly disobey and even to the point of rallying people for something. As for now, I would think the best approach to change is to educate people outside the narrative of the state being a great entity.

I personally think the battle for freedom and the preservation of Liberty is a constant one. One that should be fought be intelligent and peaceful means. That being said, I would be called to action if I witnessed the blunt murder of my fellow citizens or complete deprivation of rights. I do not think the revolution should be fought directly with violence or anarchic terrorism. This is an age of technology. I think that with the right use of technology and media a revolution could be won with minimal deaths.

I honestly don't know, it would depend on a lot of factors. I suppose that if they tried to completely restrict free speech or confiscate firearms or something like that, I would actually fight. The current infringements on our liberties are pretty bad, but I think that I would bear them as long as I could, unless there were a general uprising or they succeeded in threatening my free speech or guns.

To me the one thing that would start a war in my mind would be a wrong doing on our neighbors. I believe that our world can become powerful and peaceful if we can just work together and be equal with each other. Let our father plan our destiny.

I feel like - if I was in Katniss's case - then I would be all about starting or being a part of a rebellion. If I was treated unfairly, I would want to voice my opinion which I feel that I should be allowed to do freely and take a stand for what I believe in. Honestly, I think our government is out of control right now. I am excited to be old enough to vote in our next presidential election and in that way have a chance to voice my opinion on our leadership in our government. But honestly, something needs to be done with our leadership in America right now, and I wouldn't be surprised, if we head down the road where a rebellion might be necessary....hopefully not and I know we are no where near that point right now. But all of it is very interesting to think about. The Hunger Games truly is a great story and the character of Katniss is portrayed beautifully.

To me, to fight for my own liberty, there would have to be something else to motivate me. In Katniss' case, she had her family and initially, Prim to keep out of harms way. Next, it came to her having to pretend for the sake of keeping her family safe because without her, her family would fall apart. Then it moved towards getting Peeta back and keeping him safe. One does not fight for their own personal liberty, they fight for the liberty of the ones they love.

And if it is not for the ones they love directly because they have no one like Joanna, they fight back for what they have lost or for what they had taken from them so that no one else will have to experience that like they did.

Oppressive governments, unfair "laws", an elite that feels above us and think they can rule our lives because in their opinion we are so stupid..
Losing our liberty for their security..
Actually what is going on worldwide now days.

Exactly, we have been conditioned to bear abuse rather than react to it. I would say that most people today have a much higher threshold for tyranny than our founders did, or we would long since have had another successful revolution.

America has changed a lot, but I don't think much can change at this point.

I can not bear the wrong doing of a friend or brother of mine. I hate when people take over people to show how powerful they are.

I think it is a really difficult question.
Revolution is full of death and suffering, and it may or may not lead to a better tomorrow. However, if today is bad enough, could it be worth the risk?
I still think we should always fight for a better tomorrow, but that might not mean a traditional revolution where we fight with violence.
When is it right to use violence? I don't know. Violence deeply scars both the victims and the people who carry it out.
I think when you are threatened with violence, it is acceptable to fight back with violence. Personally I don't know if I would be able to, though. Always having lived in a peaceful society where I have more or less been free to do what I want, it's hard to know what I would do if I found myself in the opposite situation.
This is one of the most important questions in The Hunger Games.
Would the characters at the end do what they did again, knowing the outcome?
I think some would, some wouldn't.
Were they right to fight against the system, to carry out the rebellion? Of course.
What happens in between is much more complicated, with some actions black and white while others are shades of gray.
It's a really hard question with no easy answers.
I don't want to dismiss in any way the real feelings that were expressed above about the current situation in the United States. There are certainly many things that need to be addressed and fixed (war, surveillance, poverty, among many others).
However I can say that I would not want to live in any other time period in this country.
As a woman things have never been better. I would rather live now than any at other time in the past.
For women of all races, for LGBT people, for non-white people (and people not considered to be white) the past was a scary place.
Slavery, lynchings, Jim Crow laws, segregation, genocide of Native Americans, keeping women out of the public life, violence against non-straight/non-cis people, the list goes on and on. Though the US started out with the right ideals (as expressed in the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution, the Bill of Rights, etc.), these ideals and their resulting rights were only extended to a small number of people at first and it has taken a really long time to extend them to everyone, and we're still working on that.
The present is still a scary place, but it is better now in many ways, though there is a long way to go still. At the very least the atrocities I listed above are now against the law and can't be carried out with impunity.
Racism is still a problem, a serious one, but today it is not as explicit and not as accepted, though attitudes and practices persist. The law should apply to everyone equally but sadly our justice system has not conformed to this.
Income inequality is one important exception to the improvements I mentioned above. It is worse today than in the past. What can we do? I don't know, there isnʼt a simple solution and many of the solutions that are out there only put a band-aid on the problem.